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blink
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 00:32 · Edited by: blink


grrrrr arrrg. hair pulled out and just grrr.

you know i had those weird unidentifiable bugs before..

se posts http://talkto.thefrog.org/index.php?action=vthread&forum=4&topic=568

and
http://talkto.thefrog.org/index.php?action=vthread&forum=3&topic=558

well ther back. not loads yet, but they have all come out in one night, just like bafore. last time i emptied the tank, and dumped all but the water bowl, some rocks, and branches that were all bleached and boiled.
and my mother in laws tongue which i cleaned completly and dumped in boiling water. (it survived some how)...

but there back I dont know where they could have come from. they have been away for 2 months. why come back now.

any ideas or advice welcome.. I am seriously miffed. and with new frogs arriving very soon. I want to try and work out what they can be..

heres the pic again, thee arn't as many as before yet



miffed off and confused

Cate


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blink
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 00:36


just a thought. can crickets carry this sort of bug? I dont see how else they got in. and I soo dont want to ditch my mother inlaws tongue and bromiliade cos they have been cultivating for ages.....


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blink
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 01:14 · Edited by: blink


ok I have moved all but mud into the qurintine tank. hes a bugger to catch, and he seems quite chilled with them, but ill move him asap.

please someone be online. im so worried and confused to how they came back.

there was NO bug sigh yesterday and im always carful to have a good look at my tank, but tonight i come back and theres tonnes

no one has the bits yet as before. so i think I caught it early. buti need to find out how they came back. cos i cant have this hapen agian and new frogs on tues. ...



Cate


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blink
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 01:34


ok heres the nearest rendition i can do, (fredds looked itover and its as close as we can get



these are definatly adults as if you look soo carfully you can see babies all over.

if there any bug people out there. how long could it take for a bug this size to grown from egg. the weirdest thing is how they just come on suddenly in one night, but we havn't seen them for 2 months...

anxiosly awaiting anything

Cate


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waldo
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 01:39


I don't know what kind of bugs they are but I'm betting that they left eggs in you plant roots.I have a similer looking bug that lives in a plant I got from my mom,I finally threw it out.You should sterilize your tank again and this time use pesticed on your plants.In the mean time you will have to buy some more plants until your other ones are safe again.I was at wal-mart today and they have a large selection of sturdy plants on sale for $1.77,I got a mother in laws tongue,a veregated bromiliad and something with large multi-colored leaves.

blink
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 01:42 · Edited by: blink


yeah Ill do that I dont want to dump my plants, but if they just have to be house plants thats better than killing them . I just nned to nkow if 2 months is a posible incubation period for this size/type bug. if not. then they must have come in externally. possibly of ctickets. Uk last year had a MAJOR crix disease that wiped out all the brown crix. I there is only one supplier in the uk now breeding a safe batch. if there possibly from the crix i have a huge problem. My frogs lived of waxys for months last year. they cant do it again...


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waldo
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 01:44


They could have came in on something.Do you get your crix/substrate ect.. all at the same pet store?you might have to find another store to do business with.I know some bugs can delay hatching until conditions are just perfect.

blink
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 01:49 · Edited by: blink


The substrate is bed-a-beast, comes in a block and hasn't been changed since the last out brake. it was from the same store (different from crix) but i cant see how they would survive boiling water.

I 'hopefully' have some new bed-a-beast arriving tommorrow (from a different store) that was supposed to do the new frogs tank, but they it might have to be split, or continue them in the qurrinine with paper towels till i can get more. I have to order everything online, as there are no repti pet stores near me.

Im hoping its just that they stayed dormant in the tank, then i can take your advise on pestercides...


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blink
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 01:54


wel in the qurrintine tank the frogs all look ok. there watching tv, it reflects off there tank, the only place for it in the room, but they all are mermerised.

mud is still in the original tank. he's too cunning. I catch them by placing a little glass cut over them and nudging ther ebum till they jump in, then cover the bottom with my hand. but mud know s this trick and is in the corner where the cup doesn't fit. so im going to wait up as long as possible to see if i can move him.

the odd thing id mud is grreen and happy, when hes usually brown. the last time he was thi green was during the last out brake. odd...


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Roland_of_Gilead
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 01:59


Stoppit...They're just springtails, a different kind, but nevertheless springtails. They pose no threat to your herps whatsoever, and I wish mine would get to be that numerable.

You are most likely doing much more damage to your frogs than a thousand of them could by stressing them out, eventually they will die out on their own.

When your keeping naturalistic vivaria, it is allright to have decomposers such as these, if you didn't, you'd have problems.

waldo
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 02:06


last time they covered blink's frog's in bites,I'd say they do pose a threat

blink
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 02:11


ther not spring tails. ther definatly like teeni flies but they dont seem to fly. last time (if you look at my first link above)you can see the bites my frogs got. loads of tiiny red bites, they cleared up ok in a few weeks, and there definatlythe same thing.

ao i am worried. they dont look like spring tails. i am currently looking for a bug forum to try and get them identified. ..


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azureus06
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 02:12


...i agree with Roland.....sometimes even slugs and mushrooms pop up from nowhere, but die off soon...

azureus06
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 02:16


Oh....could they be tics (sp.?) if so,than they could cause lime disease (i think)...srry i cant be of more help..

blink
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 02:27


ther definatly not ticks. ther mmore like teeni flies than bugss or beatles...


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Roland_of_Gilead
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 02:40


If they are those things in the pictures, then yes, they are springtails, I have a culture of them infront of me as I type this. You may have a type of fleshfly in your tank that is biting them, but I can assure you that the species of insect above in the picture is not causing it.

Shrek
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 02:44


Roland and azureus please read the posts from before when this happened, please don't say they are nothing because obviously thay are.

ANYTHING that starts biting into your frogs must be stopped whether they are harmless bugs or not.


Cate I'm surfing the web to try and find something for you sweetie.
I think I have seen these outside on my plants.

Shrek
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 02:52


Springtails are tiny wingless insects with distinctive heads and a hump-backed appearance. Their name comes from a forked structure attached to the underside of the abdomen which acts a spring to flip them into the air. This behavior gives them the appearance of tiny fleas.
Most springtails live in rich soil or leaf litter, under bark or decaying wood, or associated with fungi. Many are scavengers, feeding on decaying plants, fungi, molds, or algae. Springtails become abundant among wet leaves, soil, and plant material along a house foundations or sidewalks where they can be a temporary annoyance. One white species lives on the surface of ponds and streams can be found in drinking water from cisterns or wells. They also can occur around floor drains, in damp basements, and crawl spaces. Masses of these insects can be swept up and discarded.

Most common springtails do not survive in dry conditions. Any steps to improve ventilation and promote drying are the best long term solutions. Removal of accumulations of wet leaves or other organic matter will eliminate breeding sites.



They don't look like these though do they? They don't look like fleas?

Shrek
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 02:53


Springtail


Shrek
Member
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 02:56 · Edited by: Shrek


They are most commonly found on or near the soil surface, usually associated with decaying vegetable matter, in rotten logs, under rocks or the bark of trees

Springtails are small wingless soft-bodied hexapods that are usually between 1 and 3 millimetres in length. Most are more easily seen with the aid of a microscope or magnifying glass although some species may grow to 10 millimetres in length and can more easily be seen. Their common name comes from the fact they can 'spring' considerable distances when disturbed. They come in a variety of colours and some even appear to have a velvet-like appearance.

These don't have wings, didn't you say yours have wings?

Shrek
Member
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 02:59


Springtails are minute, wingless insects about 1/16 to 1/8 inch (1 to 2 mm) long. Colors vary from white, gray, yellow, orange, metallic green, lavender to red with some being patterned or mottled. They get their name from the ability to catapult themselves (leap) through the air three to four inches by means of a taillike mechanism (furcula) tucked under the abdomen. When disturbed, this appendage functions as a spring, propelling them into the air away from the danger source. Young resemble adults except for size and color. Eggs are spherical.

Cate I'd say give them a nudge or poke up the bum and see if they jump like it says they are supposed to, I guess that would give you a good indication coz springtails do jump quite far

Shrek
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 03:00




Roland_of_Gilead
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 03:46 · Edited by: Roland_of_Gilead


http://www.uvm.edu/extension/publications/el/el41.htm

Aha...Perhaps this is the answer?

As Pest of Man: Springtails are not known to cause or transmit any disease of man, but a few species in Europe and North America occasionally live on man. Another species is recorded as living in powdered milk. Springtails hopping or crawling on the skin may cause itching and, when crushed on the skin, they may cause a mild, localized, allergic response.

Shrek
Member
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 03:58


Roland read her posts, they have wings she said.

It says on all the websites that springtails are definately wingless.

Charlie
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 07:34


I'm sorry I cant be much help right now. I have been waking up at 5:45am and working till 3:30pm and then getting ready to work at the pet shop from 5:00pm to 10:00pm. I have the day off from the pet shop tomorrow, I will try to see what I can find then.


We can never go back to the way it was...
cheshireycat
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 08:00


I have no clue about any of this, but I do have a sharp eye, and that pic of a spring tail looks nothing like the pick Blink shot.

Blink, how clearly can you see that they have wings?


- Evolution is a theory, not just a fact. -
blink
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 09:20


they are not springtails. I was up many hours last night looking at opick od bugs. and there not st's

the look like they have wings. but i have never seen them open. but they are definatly smooth, no visible hairs or texture and they have 2 different colours like in my drawing, they have very fine and shirt antenni, hardly visible, and dark thin legs.

this afternoon im going to try and catch one and look at it closely on white paper background so I can get a better look.

thansk for your help all Im not going to stop until i have worked out what they are and where they come frog.

CAte


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yellowboy
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 16:11


If they have wings they cannot be springtails...its possible that the eggs of these creatures stayed in the plants until it was safe to hatch and then took a while to develop after that so 2 months does not mean it came from an outside source. from your picture and drawing it is some kind of beetle or bug...does it have a pinching mouth or a piercing one? If it's a beetle it could spend a VERY long time as a larva and pupa so it will be hard to eliminate unless you take out whatever they are living in...

Heather
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 16:15


Cate,
Can you see if there is a separate head? Or ary they basically smooth bodied (head looks like it just becomes part of the body)


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Derek Benson
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# Posted: 13 Jun 2003 16:21


You people panick too much. If this happens, ditch everything that you can't treat, clean the tank thoroughly and go on. If they come back, repeat the process and look outside of the tnak for a source.


Derek Benson - Phyllomedusa/Hyperolius Enthusiast
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