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Frog Style
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# Posted: 18 Feb 2008 16:27 · Edited by: Frog Style


Hi guys,
I've noticed ALOT of posts lately about Whites Tree Frogs. Although I am new to owning the species, I am putting together a list of things about the WTF, and how to help our new members. If you see something that I missed and/or put in that may be a little wrong *PLEASE* tell me and I'll update my post. If you want anything added, I can do the same. This is just a guide to help us all getting a little more information faster on them.

There are a couple of care sheets available to you online, even here. I have found some through google leading all to the same information. Here's one that I will link:

http://allaboutfrogs.org/info/species/whites.html
www.amphibiancare.com Thanks Ragdoll for Link

Whites Tree Frogs are pretty much like any other Tree Frog that I've noticed. They do need large areas to climb, jump, sleep on. They perfer to be in a 30gal tall or so tank, for each additional WTF that you own, you should add on 10gal. to each frog. They are nocturnal, which really means they sleep during the day and are up and about at night. They pretty much live off crickets, but you can feed them worms, meal worms, wax worms, night crawlers, etc.

From my experiences, here's a list of information I've put together:

Setup:

- Atleast a 18x18x24 size tank for one to two frogs. That's about 33gals. Each additional will need 10g for each frog.
For real small or baby frogs, you should put them in a 10g tank or so. Being a larger tank like the 18x18x24, they may find that excessively big and won't be able to find their food, if at all. A 10 gallon tank should be good for the first year or so, or until you see them growing. They can live comfortably in a 10 gallon for a while.


- Background - most important thing! Your frog will need closure, and needs to know him/herself that they're safe! You don't need to cover every single side, if you have a exo-terra tank, the background is already there, so all you'd need to worry about is two sides! In my opinion, cardboard is GREAT for that.

- Hiding spots: Frogs need hiders. Whether it be plants [pothos are best!], branches, vines, fake plants... put them in there! Afterall they're tree frogs, they LOVE to climb. Give them climbing space! Your plants should be able to fit a adult size frog, as well. Although fake plants will do good along the sides of the tank [IE: The suction cups], but most importantly I would add live plants to the mix. When adding live plants [Like pothos], be sure to wash out your plants thoroughly. Even though where you get your plants may be safe, you are not 100% sure if they put fertilizer in the plants or not. After cleaning the plants, I would recommend allowing the plants to sit in a plant container for a week or so [In cocofiber substrate].

Vines are a great start, especially for baby WTFs or almost adult to even adults. You can start between thin and medium size vines for your young WTFs and work your way up to the larger size vines for the adult frogs.



Cleaning: When cleaning out a tank, make sure you have a holder tank to hold your fellow frogs. Although they don't like it, it's always good to have place for them. A 10g tank will work [has for me anyway...]. From previous advise on the forum, we have used vingear oil [err, correct me if I'm wrong, I think I am naming it wrong again] on our tanks to make sure every spot of baterica or whatever has grown on the tank is gone. Allow your tank to sit dry for a hour or so, just to make sure everything is out of that tank, that is after you dry it down some. Replace your tanks substrate, decors , etc and your frogs will be good to go!

*NOTE: Tank cleaning is not a every week basis, only when necessary or when you feel the need to clean the tank.

Substrate: I perfer [in all my tanks] CocoFiber. That stuff is just awesome for frogs, and holds moisture in very well. When breaking down the blocks, I'd recommend atleast 1 block per tank for your WTF, depending on how big your tank is, you may need two, etc. In my opinion, I'd use the spring water over tap/disstilled water, just for safety reasons.


Feeding & Water:


Feeding: All frogs love to eat! Depending on the age/size of your frog, you'll want to do a few things to get them nice , plumped and healthy.

For baby WTFs:
They need nutrients, Crickets are a wonderful diet, but so are nightcrawlers and mealworms. The most important thing you can not forget is the feeding routine. Baby WTFs need to be fed almost everyday, with about 5-8 crickets and every other day or two with calcium powder. Not only do they get their diet through the worms, crickets, nightcrawlers the calcium also gives them that extra nutrient that they need.

Adult WTFs need to be fed every 2-3 days. They don't eat as much as the baby frogs do.

You also need to be sure not to over feed your frog, whether it be a WTF, GTF, tomato frog , etc. These frogs are fat enough when they get older, feeding them excessively is not a good idea. The best way to tell if your frog has been overfed is to look at their arches [kinda like human eyebrows] that are over the frog's eardrums. If they are starting to roll over then it's time to put them on a diet, but if you can't see the rid ges at all, you should think about feeding it a little bit more.


- Water: It's common for petstores to give you wrong information, and hey...sometimes they do indeed care about you and your pet and give you the proper information you need. Please be sure that your water is not the chlorinated water. If you're going to be using tap water, do the mixture - I don't know the exact mixture, once I find this out I will update my post.

If you're not using tap water, the best water i've found when misting my tanks/giving them their bath water is the artiesan spring water. We get it from walmart. It's the bottle with the teal top. If you're cleaning the water bowls, you can use either disstilled water or your normal tap water. When you do this, be sure to dry it with paper towels very well. Also, if you're drying with paper towels, change them out each water dish you use - just to be safe!
- When I say walmart, it's in the water section that says Artesian Spring Water.
- In general tap water can be used as long as you use some dechlorinating drops like Reptisafe. For frogs you don't want one that has a slime coat or stress coating ingrediant, Reptisafe doesn't have that. I use a gallon milk jug, fill it and then add the drops, leave it sit overnight before using for the drops to do their job and the water to come to room temp. Thanks Ragdoll


- Water dish: I'd recommend a dog bowl, but one that is resistant to mold. They're pretty much deep enough for your frog to smerge their entire body in, and still have enough room for their head to be out of the water. Remember, these frogs can't swim! Although a dog dish is good for their use, you may also want to use a bowl which doesn't allow you to fill it as high. For baby WTFs [or any for that matter], you will want to not fill it to the brim, half way should do until they get a bit older.


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ravencelt
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# Posted: 18 Feb 2008 16:38 · Edited by: ravencelt


Stuck for ya, thanks for the great info Christi!


[There] [They're] [Their]
And tomorrow we'll learn to tie our shoes.
Jennifer
Member
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# Posted: 18 Feb 2008 21:55


I wouldn't recommend dog bowls -- people with juvenile, baby, or even adult frogs might fill these bowls too high and drown the frogs. Better to use a bowl which doesn't allow you to fill it that high. People who babysit frogs also will be unaware that they are not supposed to fill these to the brim. You are inviting people to kill frogs accidentally with this advice.

My frogs are fine in a 10 and 20 gallon respectively at this point. They are not 2 years old yet. One of them would never eat if he had to hunt for crickets in a bigger tank. You might want to indicate this type of potential problem.

If you want to use the word "bowl", putting the word "bowel" in there is not a good idea. Someone might think you mean what you say and that might not reflect very favorably on some aspect of your personality, state of sobriety, or proficiency at spelling. ...

I know as little as you do about water, i.e., I know what I use and I know it isn't chlorinated. But if I were writing a care sheet, I would want to put extremely precise information in there about what water to use.


FrogPrincess
Frog Style
Member
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# Posted: 18 Feb 2008 22:44


As I said I had to re-write my post. I was at work and just wrote up some, as work doesn't have a spell checker [or let me use it]. My spelling is poor, sorry Jennifer. I will re-edit my information tonight.


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Melissa Cabrera
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# Posted: 19 Feb 2008 00:33


everything you said up there is good, i do agree about the dog bowl though, that might be a little dangerous... but also when you where talking about plants. WTFs do need plants, but fake plants are not always the best to use, the fabric ones can aborb bacteria which can be harmful to the frogs, and the plastic ones are ugly... so its kinda best to go with the real thing. and because we are talking about WTF, you should think about what plants you get. these frogs will groe to be big and heavy so your plants will have to have strong leaves.
and maybe i missed it but i dont think you put anything about overfeeding. it is possible to overffed frogs. when it comes to WTF you might have a little trouble telling if they are over weight because they are chubby naturally, but the best way to tell is to look at their arches, (kinda like eyebrows) that are over the frog's eardrums. if they are starting to roll over then its time to put it on a diet... but if you cant see the ridges at all, you should think about feeding it some more.
Also, there are three different kinds, the Indonesia, Australia, and the Blue Phase. some ave said that you shouldn't house them together because they can get stressed out, but i have mine together and i have noticed that as long as you have a large enough tank for the number of WTF then you will be fine.

i night have made a few mistakes here and there so if anyone wants to correct me, feel free to do so.


2 German and Australian Shepard mixes, 12 Chickens, 2 WTF, 1 GTF, 1 Giant White Lip, 1 Sulcata tortoise, 1 Koi, and 2 Killies
Ragdoll
Member
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# Posted: 19 Feb 2008 02:31


I agree with everyone about the dog bowl thing, you'd need some rocks and branches for them to get out.

You need temp and humidity information on there, and matter of fact you should put those gauges down as necessary equipment.

Also the water, I don't know what "mix" you're talking about, but in general tap water can be used as long as you use some dechlorinating drops like Reptisafe. For frogs you don't want one that has a slime coat or stress coating ingrediant, Reptisafe doesn't have that. I use a gallon milk jug, fill it and then add the drops, leave it sit overnight before using for the drops to do their job and the water to come to room temp.

Also, most recommendations are that you can easily use a 20 gal for one adult whites, then add 10 each additional.

Tanks will need to be cleaned out differently depending on the type of setup, a natural one will only need spot cleaning, a basic paper towel one will need to be cleaned out often.

There is quite a good caresheet on www.amphibiancare.com for many types of tree frogs.


Bridget

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Dakhota
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# Posted: 19 Feb 2008 04:42


I think as long as the caregiver remembers that they can't swim (as Christi suggested), I think a dog bowl is fine . . .it's not like you're gonna be using a dish for a rotty 'cause it just wouldn't fit in the tank properly (without taking up way too much space!:lol

You did a great job Christi!

As a side note . . you may want to add a reminder that even though many pet stores say you can 'hand feed' and 'handle' the white's, you can't. . . and to 'leave them be' for a few days after arrival as they are prone to stress.


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Steven Busch
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# Posted: 19 Feb 2008 05:15


Whites tree frogs are very capably swimmers. Small or baby whites may need a water dish that is not steep and slippery so they can climb out easier. We often use baby chicken waters for baby frogs. Adults do not need large swimming areas, but do fine in deep water as long as they can climb out. Cold water can be a problem as it slows them down.


Steve Busch
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Ragdoll
Member
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# Posted: 19 Feb 2008 05:28


it's not like you're gonna be using a dish for a rotty 'cause it just wouldn't fit in the tank properly

Maybe I have a skewed view as I have a 200# English Mastiff, so her bowl is quite large!

Either way, they are usually slick when wet, so some stones or a branch going into it should be suggested so they don't get caught not being able to get out and get tired and drown.


Bridget

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Frog Style
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# Posted: 19 Feb 2008 15:48


I have updated some, but the small text box is driving me nuts. I'm still updating with information you're giving me, and what I was putting in anyhow, please correct me if I'm wrong. I'm still trying to get everything sorted into the right area. Thanks for your replies, you guys are tons of help


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ILoveGreen
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# Posted: 19 Feb 2008 17:38 · Edited by: ILoveGreen


I think some of you forgot that dog dishes come very very small too. Haha I had a tiny baby Chihuahua and her dish was half the size of the dish I used for my tiny baby WTFs.

Whites tree frogs are very capably swimmers
Thank you
And come on they are frogs! Tree Frogs can swim....just not as good as frogs. I'm not saying that they are the best swimmers(they tend to get fat and therefor more lazy or not as strong). But they can swim and jump very fast as smaller frog. Most White's just use there dish for soaking...but I has seen my younger(juvi) WTFs swimming around and floating in the water. It is still a good idea to only have the water as deep as the frog is long(nose to vent). Also it's a good idea to have something sticking out of the water that they can climb onto(incase the sides are slipery or the frog is too weak to jump out).


This was a great idea Christi. We can all learn from eachothers experiences!


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FrogGirl25
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# Posted: 8 Mar 2008 01:12


Hey I just have a question... why is it not a good idea to use water conditioner with Stress coat in it? I have been using it for more then 5 years.... it is what I was told to use when I first started with the hobby. My frogs are all very happy and healthy.

I do know I was given bad info on something in the White's hobby... and am trying to fix the bad habits.... but if the stress coat has proved to be ok (after 5 years of using it) I don't know if I want to change it. I would be worried that the frogs would get stressed out if I was to switch to something different... or do you think they would be able to tell.


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ILoveGreen
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# Posted: 8 Mar 2008 07:09 · Edited by: ILoveGreen


The frogs wouldn't be able to tell if you switched to the amphibian/reptile water conditioner. But I'm sure they would be able to tell if you just stopped using it(not that you would).

I've used the fish and reptile/amphibian water conditioners.........and haven't seen a difference either. I never really though the "slim coat" would make much of a difference. Anyone have any info or though on this?


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FrogGirl25
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# Posted: 12 Mar 2008 21:11


As I said I've been using it for 5 years now, with no problems. My frogs have great looking skin, and I don't see any abnormal behavior.




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Ragdoll
Member
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# Posted: 13 Mar 2008 01:15


The slime coat stuff is beneficial to fish but I remember seeing a post from someone not too long ago on here that it can be a problem for frogs as they need to shed. I've not had this issue, but then again, I use Reptisafe which is for reptiles/amphibians.

Not to mention some of those fish ones are dosed in tsp/gallon, which is kind of hard to figure out when you are using just a couple cups of water. Reptisafe is 2 drops/qt.


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Topgun
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# Posted: 17 Aug 2008 05:35


Hey, I've just bought a whites tree frog. I also bought a 12.5" x 12.5" exo terra tank along with two plants (fake) , two branches, a water bowl, a hut and a thermometer and hygrometer. I've decided to feed him crickets coated with calcium and vitamins. I have two question, is this size tank in fact big enough to accommodate a whites tree frog? and also, he seems to be landing pretty hard when he jumps is this normal? He seems quite resilient. Any tips would be appreciated.

Topgun
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# Posted: 21 Aug 2008 21:41


Hey, I've just recently upgraded to an 18x18x24 exo terra. Hopefully, he enjoys a larger terrarium.

darthlynsea
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# Posted: 21 Aug 2008 21:42


thank you so much for this little guide

it helped out so much




Frog Style
Member
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# Posted: 21 Aug 2008 21:57


Topgun, sorry about missing your post!

If it's a baby frog, and not yet above 2" to the 3" svl mark, they can live happily in a 10gal until they get older. Once adult size, 33gal [18x18x24] or above would be great. If you have more than 1 WTF, I'd recommend anything above a 45gal tank.

If you are coating them with calcium, please refrain from doing it too much. If it's a baby it's every 2-3 feedings if adult, every 10-ish days. That's what I do to my 3 adults, and feed about every 4th-ish feeding my baby blue phase.

How big is the water dish? Do you have any photos of the setup? When you say he's landing pretty hard, what exactly do you mean? By jumping off a branch and landing on the bottom making a lot of noise? Should be ok, long as he's not hitting/rubbing the glass with his nose, in my opinion. Someone can correct me wrong though.

Make sure there is a lot of hiding places & all 3 sides are covered for extra security. If you have any other questions, don't be afraid to ask

Darth-- you're welcome! I should update it, though.


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Topgun
Member
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# Posted: 22 Aug 2008 18:25


Hey, thanks! I've had him for a week today so i'm kind of new at this stuff. But yeh, i've bought an 18x18x24 exo terra terrarium along with 4 fake plants, some vines (that came with the terrarium) and a pothos plant and an air ferne i believe it's called. He's got a little hut as well, made of out a coconut i believe along with a water bowl big enough to fit at least 1 whites tree frog. I also have cocoa fiber substrate. I plan to cover both sides with cardboard seeing as how the back already has a background. I watch him constantly at night while watching TV and i have noticed that he has rubbed his nose, not frequently. He is still quite small, roughly 2 inches in length. I was wondering though, how do i stop him from rubbing his nose? I've been monitoring the thermometer and hygrometer, feeding him correctly but this one has stumped me. Any help would be appreciated, thank you! btw i just meant it sounds loud when he jumps from wall to wall lol. I'll try and get some pictures in.

ascurtis
Member
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# Posted: 22 Aug 2008 19:58 · Edited by: ascurtis


Hey, I recently welcomed a young whites tree frog into my home, and I was wondering how often do I dust my crickets with the vitamin dust? I'm using "T-Rex Sandfire Super Foods Tree Frog Dust ICB". I have only had him - her? - for less than a week, and I've fed him twice (3 dusted 3/4 sized crickets Monday, and the same Thursday). A friend of mine recommended not dusting the crickets every feeding, however he uses pure calcium and vitamin powder. I am wondering if I'm perhaps harming my Dumpy (his name's Anthony Hopkins, btw ) by dusting too often?

I have also noticed him rubbing his nose against the glass as well. Not often, and I've only witnessed it maybe twice. Being new at this I'm also very paranoid! He is in a 18"x18"x32" terrarium, has a long ficus plant (fake), a couple logs that reach the top of the terrarium, a coconut hut, a waterdish big enough for him to fit in and only deep enough so that his head can stay above water, and a few rocks/logs for him to perch and sunbathe. I'm using cocoa fiber substrate, de-chlorinated water for both his mistings and water dish. His thermometer stays around 80 during the day, 75ish at night, and his hygrometer reads light blue mainly.

His terrarium is perched high in my room which gets plenty of sunlight, and is situated in an empty closet with no door, so three sides are directly against the wall, and the back of his terrarium has an exo-terra background. I have contemplated the possibility that maybe since sunlight shines directly into his terrarium, he might not like that, but he enjoys the shade of his hut.

In the mornings I usually find him either sleeping in the top back left corner or under his ficus plant, in his hut, or in his water dish. I find footprints all over the face of his terrarium so I know hes active during the night. When I feed him I don't put the crickets right up to his face, instead I put the 3 crickets in there and he hunts them all down no problem.

If any of this sounds odd, please let me know!! I will make any changes necessary to make my lil guy happy! I posted a picture of him in the Frog-A-Post thread on page 11 as well.

Jennifer
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# Posted: 22 Aug 2008 20:12


He's not going to love the sunlight shining straight in ...


FrogPrincess
ascurtis
Member
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# Posted: 24 Aug 2008 03:54 · Edited by: ascurtis


ok... it only shines in directly for about an hour or two a day, and I was told that UV light is really good for him in moderation. If he feels uncomfortable he moves into his hut. I've also added another long fake ficus plant and what looks sorta like a tall Adiantum peruviana, only red and fake. This casts a shadow over a large portion of the terrarium. Is there anything else I can do to help him feel more comfortable? He doesn't seem to mind it much and when I handle him he doesn't try to get away, in fact he nuzzles up and falls asleep in my hand or on my arm. I was told this is a sign of affection.

froggyboy
Member
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# Posted: 12 Sep 2008 00:35


is it difficult to breed whites tree frogs


frogs are sooooo cool!
froggyboy
Member
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# Posted: 16 Sep 2008 01:06


I know you have heard it alot but its a question from a beginner please answer


frogs are sooooo cool!
Frog Style
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# Posted: 16 Sep 2008 01:36


I really have no idea. I haven't tried to breed mine.


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Addie
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# Posted: 16 Sep 2008 01:53


It's craaazy difficult! Many White's don't even live through the cycling, not to mention you'll end up needing a bajillion different tanks. I'd start with something a bit easier to breed.


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e.e. cummings
Amooliakin
Member
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# Posted: 16 Sep 2008 04:00


We have a baby White's and are trying to do everything correctly. So far however he does not want to eat crickets and will only eat wax worms. I read that these are not so great.... but that's what he was getting in the pet store so I guess he is used to it. Will they make him constipated or overly fat? He is so tiny now....

Amooliakin
Member
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30 posts

# Posted: 16 Sep 2008 04:01


Also - I just realized we don't have hiding places for him. But he does crouch behind a rock and under the fake plant. Is that adequate?

Amooliakin
Member
30 posts
30 posts

# Posted: 16 Sep 2008 04:11


Just thought of another question..... sorry to be so chatty... but how fast should I expect our frog to grow? He (or she) is only about an inch long at the moment. Thanks...

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